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Legal advice about vaccines

Phil10

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I'm living in England. Stuff is reopening indoors (mostly) 17th of May. Cinemas should be open by that date. But you may need to book in advance due to distancing requirements.

The vaccine passport thing - pub passports are off. Talk of it has gone very quiet - chances are it wont pass parliment, beyond if its needed to allow entry to other countries, so it all could be off. For stuff in the UK might be needed for - seems as though it will be either vaccine, prior infection in the last six months, or negative lateral flow test taken less than 3 days ago. Those are the tests that give you a result in half an hour. Do not know what the situation is in Scotland with getting those. Did hear I think they were supposed to be availibille for all up there. I know if you're in England you can walk into a test centre and just get one done, no questions asked, free of charge. Takes about five minutes, result texted to youhalf an hour later. Can get a pack of seven posted to your here, I do not know if you can do that in Scotland.

Going abroad - cant give you any answers there at the moment. It will not be forever, but the testing requirements will probably be there over the summer. They have not announced anything officially. Say they will sometime May though. There is just rumours now. Countries will be put in red, amber, green. Green will likely mean no quarantine. Rumours you will need a test though to get back into the UK, vaccine or no. Only countries that I've seen could be green are Israel, US, Iceland, Gibraltar, Malta, Portugal.

If you are going to book a holiday abroad, I would either hold off until you know for certain which countries will let you in and which will be greenlisted, or make sure that whatever you book is fully flexible.
Yep I can’t have those swab ones due to my anxiety I would need a saliva one which costs £120 pounds. Should I just enjoy going in UK for moment and try see what happens in 2022? I mean I don’t want to rush aboard with all the rules my worry is this was a long term thing but most people said it shouldn’t be? One of my worries is if I took a test it would be positive and not very accurate? I would be terrified going on holiday or a gig wondering what the test may say? Or if my wife tested positive? I really don’t want regular tests I hope it doesn’t become the norm. I am probably over worrying as mass testing has been rolled out and not many people have them to be honest?
I have a few things planned a hotel and trip to England not done most of these in six months to a year I am trying to say that’s good I can do that but still worry about the freedoms and stuff I can’t do?
 

Otherside

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For now I'd just stay in UK, see how things are 2022.

I do not think mass testing for things in the UK will be compulsory. Encouraged, yes, they are doing that - but not enforced. Havent heard of any business asking to see the its negative text or a vaccine card.

When it comes to the long term - it will not last longer than nessecary. There is costs involved with the testing were doing at the moment, cannot see the government being willing to continue to fund that longer than needed. Enough people I would think in Boris's own party who'd cause problems for him if it did continue when it was not needed. The same who are not happy with the vaccine passport idea. They are fairly libertarian, they are not happy with the restrictions even when they are needed, they will not allow them to continue when they are not, some already think reopening is too slow.

With the case/death numbers being low as they are at the moment? If the restrictions did not lift on the timeline that has been set (17 May opening up indoors for most things, then all social limits going June/July I think), they will cause problems for him.

It is hard though, I agree - honestly have thought a few times that this does seem like it will never end. Worry is there at the back of my mind.
 

Phil10

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It’s been a while since I posted about this do people see vaccine passports going ahead? I seen some countries will let people in without them but we have an Indian variant which seems to be pushing there use and delaying lockdown exit? How long before the pandemic ends and I can travel around freely or host a small party?
 

Cuchculan

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Lot of people out there simply trying to make ends meet and stay healthy and your concerns are a party and a holiday? Man. I think you will be waiting for both. Have said I think all holidays should not be allowed until 2022. Until we know the state of things and how vaccines are working out. This year we will not be able to tell much at all. They allow people to go on holidays and the virus will simply continue. Just stop all movement from country to country until 2022. We know they won't do that. Will you need a vaccine passport? Depends on were you want to visit.
 

Phil10

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I see Spain won’t require a PCR test or vaccine certificate to enter and they don’t be needed for pubs. Are you more confident how than a few months ago? Could it be possible life like 2019 May return? I seen masks will be dropped in June too?
 

Phil10

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So is there hope to go abroad like 2019 times that Spain won’t demand a vaccine passport? Will others follow eventually?
 

Cuchculan

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Why Spain? Lot of nice places in Scotland. Spain might get greedy and allow tourists in. That will help nothing at all. Holidays to such countries should be banned till next year.
 

CdTb

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I'd have thought the places with the most permissive access requirements are probaby the places you'd want to most avoid, no? Spain's policy id probably driven more by economic pressure than epidemiologial ones.
You've also got to consider what restrictions might be placed on you coming back if the status of a country changes whilst you're over there - would you actually be able to relax?
 

Phil10

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Why Spain? Lot of nice places in Scotland. Spain might get greedy and allow tourists in. That will help nothing at all. Holidays to such countries should be banned till next year.
I have been most places in scotland 6x over. Gets boring I mean my dream is to go to American but have a fear of flying particularly long haul and a bigger fear of boats so I have no idea how I can get there?

I just want to be free to do things really feels like they are stealing my life. But good news is cinemas open nothing out I want to see but I am free to go and that’s a huge relief just being free to do something. I believe travel can open especially with vaccines we need normal life to resume no passports nothing. I fear 2021 is a bit of a write off especially for foreign travel and gigs. I have been desperate to see friends and go to a pub or have a party but none can happen. I see people in there 20’s doing it but my friends are in there 30’s so never hear a peep. All very frustrating.
 

Cuchculan

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Maybe your friends are the smart ones out there. Playing it safe for now. Fact is we won't know much until next year. By then we will have a better picture as to how things are shaping up. The last pandemic lasted 4 years. That was the Spannish flu. Oddly enough it had nothing got to do with Spain at all. Though they got blamed for it. With something like this it is harder to stop. because it acts to similar to a flu. It is worse than a flu. It passes in much the same way from person to person. Much harder to stop. We are all fed up with it. What exactly can we do? Just play it safe. Hope for the best. This Winter will be important. As in if anything happens this Winter. They are half expecting another great surge. Fact is the experts have no real idea what will happen next. By opening countries back up they will get a better picture. About how safe it is to go that bit further. If things go badly wrong, it might be back into another lockdown. They just have to do it slowly. Step by step. Watch what happens. See if it is good or bad. Get a better look at the vaccines. See if they are working as expected or not. Only time will tell.
 

Phil10

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I see they are having COVID passports for Wembley so it has happened but will it go to other events too? Israel has ditched them yet UK still keen to press on? On Sky News they said travel wouldn’t return to normal until WHOLE world vaccinated so seems this goes on and on?
 

Phil10

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I feel fed up. Cases rising again and no sign of foreign travel abroad. And they say masks and home working forever?? Is this ever going to end?
 

Cuchculan

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Since you last posted here there have been 2 new variants. That is what people seem to be catching. Especially in the UK. They are unsure if the vaccinations work against the new variants. This is what might just keep on happening. Just when it looks like things are getting good along comes another variant. Here in Ireland restrictions on people coming from the UK has gotten tougher because of this. Other countries might get just as tough on people trying to enter their country from the UK. No holidays for another while. Doubt any holidays will be allowed this year. But I did say that months ago. As for football? They are playing it safe. This might happen with other things too. But you can't lose your job. You job is safe. Vaccine or no vaccine. They were talking about that the other day. You can not be sacked for refusing the vaccine.
 

Phil10

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Since you last posted here there have been 2 new variants. That is what people seem to be catching. Especially in the UK. They are unsure if the vaccinations work against the new variants. This is what might just keep on happening. Just when it looks like things are getting good along comes another variant. Here in Ireland restrictions on people coming from the UK has gotten tougher because of this. Other countries might get just as tough on people trying to enter their country from the UK. No holidays for another while. Doubt any holidays will be allowed this year. But I did say that months ago. As for football? They are playing it safe. This might happen with other things too. But you can't lose your job. You job is safe. Vaccine or no vaccine. They were talking about that the other day. You can not be sacked for refusing the vaccine.
Thanks I am glad you think I won’t lose my job that would be a huge relief. I don’t want forced to have the vaccine to go anywhere though. I mean I wish I could travel but seems this pandemic is never ending. 80% in uk now jabbed I wonder how long this goes on?
Also my wife had the vaccine so if I have not had it she would need to quarantine or only me? It’s very confusing but I think there will be lots of families where one person isn’t jabbed whole family have to quarantine?
 
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Cuchculan

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What you talk about is only is a person in the family is expected to have Covid. In that case the whole family would be close contacts. Vaccine or not. The vaccine only reduces your chances of getting Covid. If you do get it, it will be a weaker version. So a person who is vaccinated can still get it and can still spread it to others.
 

Phil10

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What you talk about is only is a person in the family is expected to have Covid. In that case the whole family would be close contacts. Vaccine or not. The vaccine only reduces your chances of getting Covid. If you do get it, it will be a weaker version. So a person who is vaccinated can still get it and can still spread it to others.
So that means the quarantining and testing goes on indefinitely? We don’t test for flu and they say we have to live with this virus like flu. Surely locking the borders forever isn’t the answer? Many fear travel will be for the rich only now
Do you think I will ever be able to go on holiday again?
 
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Otherside

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Phil - news here likes to really go overboard here. Has done for he last few years. Take any offhand comment that is said and sensastionalize it. Saw one a while back where they insisted that "life will never go back to normal, self isolation if sick forever", based on a comment from a doctor saying "We don't usually advise people to go into work if they have the flu." Doesn't make so much money if it isn't over the top.

US Office has been asking people over there if they are vaccinated or not - has not happened here yet woith us, consensus so far has been "Would be legal issues doing that" and "GDPR Issues". We will see if that holds and if I get an email asking about it soon or not. But does seem as though firing employees for not being vaccinated would be illegal - The exception being care home staff and medics, but then already need Hep B if you're a doctor.

Holidays abroad - probably not this summer. Although there is Gibraltar I suppose for sort of abroad.
 

Phil10

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Phil - news here likes to really go overboard here. Has done for he last few years. Take any offhand comment that is said and sensastionalize it. Saw one a while back where they insisted that "life will never go back to normal, self isolation if sick forever", based on a comment from a doctor saying "We don't usually advise people to go into work if they have the flu." Doesn't make so much money if it isn't over the top.

US Office has been asking people over there if they are vaccinated or not - has not happened here yet woith us, consensus so far has been "Would be legal issues doing that" and "GDPR Issues". We will see if that holds and if I get an email asking about it soon or not. But does seem as though firing employees for not being vaccinated would be illegal - The exception being care home staff and medics, but then already need Hep B if you're a doctor.

Holidays abroad - probably not this summer. Although there is Gibraltar I suppose for sort of abroad.
I just worry I will never get abroad again without a vaccine passport test or mask or quarantine? Will it ever go back to personal risk just going abroad as normal maybe mid decade end of decade? People said holidays might happen in 2021 but that’s two years now I enjoy travelling so all this sucks?
 

Otherside

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Yeah, tell me about it. Lack of travel I think is the one that has sucked the most here. Have family in US, haven't seen quite a few of them now in a year and half.

Think vaccine passports/tests probably won't last beyond (at worst) mid to late 2023, beyond possibly a few countries that are fairly strict to begin with requiring them - already a few countries that require yellow fever vaccines to enter. Can see Singapore requiring it, for example. NZ and Aus possibly, already looking as though they'll stay shut though for a while. Can't see US and most of Europe asking though long term.
 
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