Corona shot

[Lanchparty7]

I have actually been discussing this topic with my therapist quite a bit. I was certain I was one of the few not wanting to take the shot as mostly everyone I am close to were eager to get it as soon as they could. But he said I am most definitely not alone as he said he had a number of other patients who share my concerns. Plus I have listened to my local talk station discuss this and they have taken numerous calls from vaccine hesitant folks. Feel better knowing there are others out there and that I am not alone in my hesitation.

 

[Cirqueme]

Is anyone besides me afraid of taking the shot? I keep thinking I’ll be the one in 1 million that will get a blood clot from it or something worse.

I'm not afraid of it, but I'm not getting it..... yes, there are definitely side effects to it that affect people differently. I'm just not huge on vaccines in the first place.

 

[Fraser]

I am too scared to take the shot. My daughter is 16 and they had a big discussion in school about it and she begged me not to force her to take it. She is scared about side effects down the road. I cant blame her because I am too!! I always get my kids vaccinated as well as myself, but this one just scares me. I have actually had covid. I couldn't smell and was congested a little bit. She had it as well. She had a dry cough and couldn't smell. We both already have the antibodies so I'm not worried about getting the shot for that reason also. I am going to get my son tested for antibodies at his yearly check up.

This is bad thinking and an inaccurate understanding of the science. I hope she isn't being taught in school that the vaccine is bad, but if you're from the Southern United States I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case.

We are in Wyoming where the overall attitude is "We don't need no stinking vaccine." Of course we get the guilt trip commercials. I won't personally get the vaccine just because we don't even know what the potential side effects could be but that's a personal choice and I would never pick on anyone who chose to get it. I think that should go both ways. I know people who have gotten it with few adverse side effects and I know people who have gotten COVID who equated it to a bad cold or flu and even some with no symptoms. There is just so much we don't know both ways.

There's actually a lot we know, including about side effects and the risks, both to the individual and to wider society, of not getting the vaccine. There's also increasing information about Covid, its effects in the long term (even for people with minor symptoms) and the incredible burden it is poised to put on healthcare systems. Getting the shot or not getting the shot is a choice that people get to make for themselves, but not getting the shot is, very clearly, a bad idea.

 

[Phillies Phan]

This is bad thinking and an inaccurate understanding of the science. I hope she isn't being taught in school that the vaccine is bad, but if you're from the Southern United States I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case.

So true, Fraser. so sadly true.


There's actually a lot we know, including about side effects and the risks, both to the individual and to wider society, of not getting the vaccine. There's also increasing information about Covid, its effects in the long term (even for people with minor symptoms) and the incredible burden it is poised to put on healthcare systems. Getting the shot or not getting the shot is a choice that people get to make for themselves, but not getting the shot is, very clearly, a bad idea.

I'm not afraid of it, but I'm not getting it..... yes, there are definitely side effects to it that affect people differently. I'm just not huge on vaccines in the first place.

Hi Cirq,

Naturally, you’re a grown adult and can make your own decisions on the vaccine, but please don’t be taken in by the politics of COVID, especially if you live in certain portions of the US. Not being huge on vaccines is a strange comment in my opinion. Vaccines have saved us from having children crippled with polio, stricken with lockjaw, measles and mumps each of which can cause lifelong consequences, like for example, deafness from mumps.

 

[ThankfulJen]

There's actually a lot we know, including about side effects and the risks, both to the individual and to wider society, of not getting the vaccine. There's also increasing information about Covid, its effects in the long term (even for people with minor symptoms) and the incredible burden it is poised to put on healthcare systems. Getting the shot or not getting the shot is a choice that people get to make for themselves, but not getting the shot is, very clearly, a bad idea.

Just like not wearing a mask was a very bad idea, right? Although I did wear my mask when shopping out of respect to those who believed in it. Now, we find out that the very man everyone trusted, the expert himself was lying about the effectiveness of the mask. And people are STILL going around wearing the mask. Even the vaccinated! I don't want to argue with anyone over the validity of, the effectiveness of, the politics of the vaccination . It really is a personal choice wether to get the vaccine or not and no one else's business. Trust the experts, right? Because they have all been so honest with us this far.

 

[Fraser]

Just like not wearing a mask was a very bad idea, right? Although I did wear my mask when shopping out of respect to those who believed in it. Now, we find out that the very man everyone trusted, the expert himself was lying about the effectiveness of the mask. And people are STILL going around wearing the mask. Even the vaccinated! I don't want to argue with anyone over the validity of, the effectiveness of, the politics of the vaccination . It really is a personal choice wether to get the vaccine or not and no one else's business. Trust the experts, right? Because they have all been so honest with us this far.

All of none of this is true. You've been fed misinformation by right wing media regarding the content and context of Fauci's emails. Here's what actually happened and how Fauci's understanding of masks changed over time. And yes, not wearing a mask is a very bad idea. The science on this is extremely clear. It's not a matter of opinion.

Fact check: Missing context in claim about emails, Fauci's position on masks

A Feb. 5 email Dr. Anthony Fauci sent is being held up as evidence he knew masks were ineffective. That is missing context.

www.usatoday.com

Regarding the idea that getting a vaccine or not is a personal choice; that's true. It is someone's personal choice whether or not to get the vaccine, just like it's someone's personal choice to eat Mcdonalds every day. That doesn't mean there is no right or wrong answer as to whether or not eating McDonald's every day is a good idea or not. As to whether or not it's anyone else's business, it is a choice that affects everyone. In order to get immunity levels to a high enough degree to halt the pandemic, vaccination levels need to come in at around an estimated 70% (although infection rates can lower that number by an unknown amount). Unfortunately, due to vaccine misinformation, a lot of people are vaccine hesitant which is putting this process in jeopardy in a way that could cause tens of thousands of unnecessary and pointless deaths. When you choose not to get the vaccine, your choice puts you at greater risk of getting the disease, which then puts you at a greater risk of being a vector for spreading the illness. I don't see it happening in America, but hopefully other countries use some kind of vaccination passport system in schools, public buildings, public transport and workplace spaces.

 

[Cirqueme]

Hi Cirq,

Naturally, you’re a grown adult and can make your own decisions on the vaccine, but please don’t be taken in by the politics of COVID, especially if you live in certain portions of the US. Not being huge on vaccines is a strange comment in my opinion. Vaccines have saved us from having children crippled with polio, stricken with lockjaw, measles and mumps each of which can cause lifelong consequences, like for example, deafness from mumps.

Last I checked I could have my own opinion...I don't care if you get vaccines or not... I'M NOT!!!!

I have actually been discussing this topic with my therapist quite a bit. I was certain I was one of the few not wanting to take the shot as mostly everyone I am close to were eager to get it as soon as they could. But he said I am most definitely not alone as he said he had a number of other patients who share my concerns. Plus I have listened to my local talk station discuss this and they have taken numerous calls from vaccine hesitant folks. Feel better knowing there are others out there and that I am not alone in my hesitation.

https://cdn.frankspeech.com/audio/Bulletin-COVIDVaccinesCouldCauseIrreversibleHarmCDCNOTTellingYou-LedgerReport111/mp3/Bulletin-COVIDVaccinesCouldCauseIrreversibleHarmCDCNOTTellingYou-LedgerReport111.mp3

Give this a listen.

Last I checked I could have my own opinion...I don't care if you get vaccines or not... I'M NOT!!!!

https://cdn.frankspeech.com/audio/Bulletin-COVIDVaccinesCouldCauseIrreversibleHarmCDCNOTTellingYou-LedgerReport111/mp3/Bulletin-COVIDVaccinesCouldCauseIrreversibleHarmCDCNOTTellingYou-LedgerReport111.mp3

Give this a listen.

I work in the operating room and I am a medical coder. I've seen really harmful reactions to getting the vaccine.

 

[Fraser]

Last I checked I could have my own opinion...I don't care if you get vaccines or not... I'M NOT!!!!

https://cdn.frankspeech.com/audio/Bulletin-COVIDVaccinesCouldCauseIrreversibleHarmCDCNOTTellingYou-LedgerReport111/mp3/Bulletin-COVIDVaccinesCouldCauseIrreversibleHarmCDCNOTTellingYou-LedgerReport111.mp3

Give this a listen.

I work in the operating room and I am a medical coder. I've seen really harmful reactions to getting the vaccine.

Of course you can have your own opinion. That's not a claim to the truth though; your opinion can be that 2+2=5, and that's still just wrong. If your opinion is that the risks associated with vaccines outweigh the risks associated with Covid, that's wrong and demonstrably so.

Similarly, we can opinions about your opinion. That's something we are entitled to as well. For instance, that link you shared is blatantly right wing American propaganda (a "Constitutionally Conservative" radio show) and your being a medical decoder doesn't give you special insight into the side effects of vaccinations versus Covid. What you are doing is spreading misinformation and fear, and it's grossly irresponsible, particularly given that this is a forum for anxiety.

 

[ThankfulJen]

Of course you can have your own opinion. That's not a claim to the truth though; your opinion can be that 2+2=5, and that's still just wrong. If your opinion is that the risks associated with vaccines outweigh the risks associated with Covid, that's wrong and demonstrably so.

Similarly, we can opinions about your opinion. That's something we are entitled to as well. For instance, that link you shared is blatantly right wing American propaganda (a "Constitutionally Conservative" radio show) and your being a medical decoder doesn't give you special insight into the side effects of vaccinations versus Covid. What you are doing is spreading misinformation and fear, and it's grossly irresponsible, particularly given that this is a forum for anxiety.

That's pretty hypocritical of you to say as you are doing the same thing by telling people they are wrong for not getting it. That it's dangerous not to get it. That they should have some sort of vaccine passport in place for.schools, stores, and the like. You can believe your sources and others can take the word of other sources. The verdict is out on so much. Many of us had a feeling that the virus was created and subsequently spread from the Wuhan lab in China, but for a long time that was considered 'right wing propaganda. Major cover up yet people were being accused of being racist for even suggesting it. There is the truth and there are lies and what's really going on is somewhere in the middle. You want to believe the same people who tried their hardest to cover the Chinese government's butt go on and do it. Don't need to go after those who disagree with you and then take it a step further and accuse them of being 'grossly irresponsible' and the like. We get it. You know the facts. You're getting or have gotten vaccination which makes you very responsible and better than those who choose not to.

 

[Cuchculan]

My own two cents on vaccines? They didn't know all the side effects of the vaccines when they rushed them out there. They knew only some of the side effects. Which is why in a lot of countries there is a phone number that you ring up if you experience anything not on the side effects list. If they get a number of calls about a certain thing, they simply add it to the possible side effects list. Which is been updated as we go along. A clear sign they don't know the full side effects of the vaccines.

As for were the virus came from? This is still up for debate. We do know the Chinese lied. It did not come from a Bat as they tried to tell the world. People who tried to let the world know about Covid vanished. Good few of them at that. We will never know the full truth of what exactly we are dealing with. Because China is protecting its own rear end. If they were more honest with the world and said they botched up trying some new experiement or other, at least people would know how to go about finding a proper answer. But that will never happen.

As for face masks? They do not protect the person wearing the face mask. In some countries people think they are safe just because they have a face mask on. Load of rubbish. Stop a person spreading it. Now if they had faith in their own vaccines there would be no need for face masks if a person gets the vaccine. That is something they seem to lack. Faith in their own vaccines.

 

[Phillies Phan]

Last word from me on these issues. If a person decides solely for themselves not to vaccinate (other than COVID), their choice. God bless. If however that person whoever she might be has children, it is my opinion, (which I think I’m still entitled to Mr. Hannity?) that she would be morally reprehensible to hold back vaccinations. In many cases, there are rightly so consequences for a parent/guardian who will not vax their children.

As for the COVID vax, you’re “lucky” you live in certain portions of the US; in many places businesses will decide whether to permit you to enter their establishment based upon your vax status. Their right, same as no shirt, no service. We’ve all been through hell in the past 15 months. In the US 600,000 have died. Countless others have and are still suffering. Changes were rightly made after 9-11 to protect us from future attacks. To the extent things must change to protect us from another nightmare scenario with another pandemic, so be it.

 

[Cuchculan]

It is all a choice. No matter if you have kids or not. Just because a person has kids should not mean they should be made take a vaccine they don't want to take. Kids should never be used in that kind of way. You have kids, you must be vaccinated. Load of rubbish. Kids are not bait. To use them as bait is wrong. It does not mean one parent is better than another because one got the vaccine and the other refused it.

Here in Ireland we are behind on everything. Longest lockdown anywhere in the world. People are fed up. We have had riots. Good few of them. All this thing of no vaccine, no entry will never happen. Unless it is travel. As each country can have its own rules. Even in work, for example, you can not be fired from your job if you refuse the vaccine. That was made very clear. Businesses lost out so much here they are simply happy to have customers back again. They are not going to refuse you because you are not vaccinated. They have lost earnings to make up on.

75% will get vaccinated at least. That will be good enough. Then people talk about herd immunity. It can happen with 75% vaccinated. All we really need are answers from China. About how it really began. Not the Bat eating BS story. The truth. Vaccines might mean nothing with the various variants. If you have no idea what you are really dealing with it is hard to fix. China has the answers. But they are not telling anybody. Probably because they can't solve what they started.

 

[Fraser]

That's pretty hypocritical of you to say as you are doing the same thing by telling people they are wrong for not getting it. That it's dangerous not to get it. That they should have some sort of vaccine passport in place for.schools, stores, and the like. You can believe your sources and others can take the word of other sources. The verdict is out on so much. Many of us had a feeling that the virus was created and subsequently spread from the Wuhan lab in China, but for a long time that was considered 'right wing propaganda. Major cover up yet people were being accused of being racist for even suggesting it. There is the truth and there are lies and what's really going on is somewhere in the middle. You want to believe the same people who tried their hardest to cover the Chinese government's butt go on and do it. Don't need to go after those who disagree with you and then take it a step further and accuse them of being 'grossly irresponsible' and the like. We get it. You know the facts. You're getting or have gotten vaccination which makes you very responsible and better than those who choose not to.

What are your sources? As in literally, what are your actual sources for determining things like your stance on masks? Cirqueme suggested that people get some information from a conservative talk radio show. That's not a study. That's not peer reviewed. It's not a meta-analysis or even a think piece by an expert in the field (which is a really low bar for a source). You suggested that you don't believe in face masks because Fauci lied about them (he didn't, but that's neither here nor there). Fauci isn't a source one way or the other though, he's a mouthpiece for policy because he's an expert on infectious diseases. The opinion of a single person, however much of an expert they are, isn't what determines whether or not we should believe that masks help stop spread Covid; actual peer reviewed science is. If you have studies that demonstrate the inefficacy of masks in relation to Covid, by all means share them.

Meanwhile, here is the kind of science that should and does inform policy at the international level:

From Nature, a leading scientific journal: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0843-2#Sec3

From The New England Journal of Medicine: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2007800

And a metanalysis of the available evidence from the Proceeding of the National Academy of Sciences of the United States of America: https://files.fast.ai/papers/masks_lit_review.pdf

Regarding the vaccine, it is dangerous not to get it. That's not fear mongering; that's the risk/benefit analysis that we have with the available data.

 

[ThankfulJen]

A review with further reviews included.

Masks Don’t Work: A Review of Science Relevant to COVID-19 Social Policy

There have been extensive randomized controlled trial (RCT) studies, and meta-analysis reviews of RCT studies, which all show that masks and respirators do not work to prevent respiratory influenza-like illnesses, or respiratory illnesses believed to be transmitted by droplets and aerosol...

www.rcreader.com

Masks DON'T stop the spread of Covid, top experts say

Oxford University's Professor Carl Heneghan and Dr Tom Jefferson said there had been 'a troubling lack of robust evidence on face masks and Covid-19'.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Should you wear a face mask? WHO officials weigh in

At a briefing today, WHO officials said they recommend that masks be worn by those with coronavirus or those in close contact with people infected.

www.weforum.org

And I'll throw in my ENT doctor who firmly believes masks don't prevent the Corona virus.

 

[Lanchparty7]

My state has now reached the benchmark that was set for reopening and nearly all restrictions and capacity limits have been lifted. Since my employer was “waiting for guidance” from the state, I guess this means we will be returning to the office sometime soon, which could be a problem for me. I am not vaccinated and do not plan to be but there is a distinct possibility that they will require it to return to the office. Even if they don’t, I have mixed feelings about returning because I somehow feel vaccine status of the staff will be known and as I have already experienced(within my own family), those of us who are not vaccinated are looked down upon and questioned and lectured to. As much as I need to return to the office in person, just think it will not go well and be super uncomfortable for me as an unvaccinated person.

 

[Cuchculan]

Proof is there for all sides. Because different people have different views. Some experts are against face masks. They think they do nothing at all. Others are for them. Think their claim is it lowers the risk of infection to at least 50%. What about the other 50%? Bit like a toss of a coin. Heads you get Covid. Tails, you don't. Those studies were done in China and other Asian countries. Places were they wear face masks most of the time as a rule and have always done so. So the odds are the exact same both ways. So nobody actually wins.

Have been a few doctors here in Ireland who refused to give people the vaccine. Instead of been asked to explain why, they were struck off the medical list. Again medical experts with different opinions than others. You will never get everybody to agree 100% of the time. That has never happened with anything. This is no different at all.

 

[Phillies Phan]

I’m a proud American but at this point in time, I am so glad that I live in Canada.

 

[Cuchculan]

I’m a proud American but at this point in time, I am so glad that I live in Canada.

I am sure Americans are happy that you live in Canada too.

 

[Phillies Phan]

I am sure Americans are happy that you live in Canada too.

No need to get nasty Cuch. I wouldn’t disrespect your nationality and would expect you wouldn’t disrespect mine. In America, we have the right to both love our country and yet protest, as is evident by comments on both sides in this post, made by citizens of the US.

You are an excellent source of info and reassurance when it comes to anxiety. I suggest you stick to what you do best.

 

[Cuchculan]

GBAN. Know what that is? That is BANG out of order.